Q: How to Apply Lean Innovation Methods To Regulated Industries

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, skmurphy

Q: My research focused on the assessment of atherosclerosis in coronary arteries using  Computed Tomography examinations as the imaging modality. I have looked at various aspects of atherosclerosis such as volume scores, automatic extraction of anatomical structures, plaque detection, dual energy CT and plaque distribution patterns. I am new to the lean innovation methods and am having difficulty applying methods like minimum viable product (MVP) in my industry, medical imaging,  which is heavily regulated. I cannot see how to do incremental updates given the level of regulatory signoff required.

We have worked with a number of medical instrument and “medical workflow” startups who face this challenge in different ways. And our work on the BeamWise team has led to a number of conversations with medical imaging and instrumentation companies developing new products.

Lean Innovation: Established Firms Vs. Startups

An established firm with existing customers should invest effort in instrumenting current offerings to get a better handle on actual use and duty cycle, and allow the technicians/researchers/doctors to provide feedback in context (at point of care or point of use) for shortcomings or issues. More simply, take a hard look at how folks are using your current product before proposing something new.

Startups need to separate the challenges of image collection from the usability. For new modalities of image collection you need to work with research groups to be able to get access to tissue samples or live subjects depending upon your application. Often a veterinary or agricultural application is an easier way in than aiming directly at human subject applications, once you have  established the usefulness finding teams that want to work with you on human subjects becomes easier. If your primary worry (or innovation) is more about usability or image presentation then you can work from “canned” image data sets and pay technicians, researchers, or doctors to take part in feedback sessions where they interact with the images produced (perhaps in the context of your user interface)  and give you feedback.

Net net, even though the final configuration is subject to rigorous review you can find ways to test different critical aspects of your product and iterate without having to get final approval.

Consider Attending Great Demo Workshop

You might also consider our October 15-16 “Great Demo” workshop, a number of medical imaging firms have attended over the years and have found that Peter Cohan offered a number of valuable insights they were able to incorporate into their discovery conversations and demos of new products.

You are also welcome to schedule a no cost office hours session if you want to talk further and have us help you design some experiments to move your MVP forward.

Write Down Key Commitments And Questions That Need Answers

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Consulting Business, Demos, skmurphy

When You Don’t Know The Answer Write Down The Question

My second “real job” was doing pre and post sales support  at a software startup. I had been hired at the same time as an older and more experienced engineer and after about two weeks on the job he took me aside and advised, “buy a notebook and write down any commitments you make and any questions you promise to get answers for.” He was about eight years older so I figured his memory had started to go. Also, he was not my boss. I ignored him.

Within about six weeks I had missed a few deliveries on promised items or answers and it was clear that I had mis-assessed. So I started to carry a lab notebook and write down summaries of every conversation. I included details to jog my memory like date, time, location, attendees and highlighted any commitments I made or answers that I promised.

I learned that the act of writing down a commitment in front of the customer and then replaying it for confirmation underscored that I was actually listening. At the end of the meeting I would summarize all of my commitments (or “action items”) and any questions I needed to research for a final check.

Later I learned a technique called “the parking lot” where you write down on a flip chart or white board  any questions you that either want to defer to later in conversation or you need to research. I then discovered that once I started to hold myself accountable in a public way in a meeting I could also include commitments that others had made or questions that they had promised to research in my closing summary and now we were all jointly accountable.

There is a strong temptation to avoid saying “I don’t know” and to guess at an answer or to provide a partial answer. For complex technical questions, answers that you may score as “mostly correct” tend to be rated as “you wasted my time with a wrong answer” by the customer.

In particular in a pre-sales situation saying “I don’t know, let me get back to you this afternoon (or tomorrow or next week depending upon urgency and complexity)” makes your other answers more credible because you have shown that you are willing to admit when you don’t know.

In my next job I was surprised when my boss’ boss would say, “I don’t know” clearly and frequently and I came to appreciate that “I don’t know” is actually an answer that is a hallmark of expertise. Experts know where their knowledge ends and are willing to label speculation as speculation so as not to intentionally mislead.

Here are some other refinements that I now use in remote meetings:

  • In a Skype session I take notes of what the other person is saying in the text chat. This demonstrates that I am actually listening and allows them to correct something I have gotten wrong or to add a key point that I didn’t include in my notes. When the session is done I have already documented it and had it reviewed by the other attendees so I can mail out the transcript if I am pressed for time, or take 10-30 minutes refine and summarize in addition to providing my raw notes.
  • The option for shared note taking by contributing to the chat also encourages the other participants to add their own notes. If many people are on the call the text chat can also allow one or more chat-based conversations to proceed in parallel.
  • You can also run a separate chat window just for your team so that you have a back channel to enable better coordination. Be careful you are typing public notes in the public chat and private notes in the private chat. Typing a public note in the private chat has an effect similar to waiting for an answer after you commented when your mike is mute. Typing a private note in the public window can be much more problematic – don’t write anything you would not want disclosed accidentally.
  • Shared note taking works if you want to use Google Docs or Primary Pad or another shared edit platform that allows for realtime update by multiple people.
  • In a webinar or screen sharing session open a Notepad or Word Doc or text file and type your “parking lot” notes into it as you are walking through a presentation or demo. As you go back you can turn them into strikethrough text or put an [x] in the front of each item as you complete it. You are left with a set of action items you can then confirm need to be address–and by when–for all parties as appropriate.

Related blog posts

Other articles

Tools vs. Methods vs. Policies

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Rules of Thumb

What’s interesting about digital tools for information work is how frequently they are born from a specific ideology: someone thought work should be done in a certain manner, they found no tools to support that method, so they set off to build their own tool that presumes their ideology is true and best. Thus, we get another to-do app, Twitter client, or project management app.

Everything that’s made has a bias, but simple implements—a hammer, a lever, a text editor—assume little and ask less. The tool doesn’t force the hand. But digital tools for information work are spookier. The tools can force the mind, since they have an ideological perspective baked into them. To best use the tool, you must think like the people who made it. This situation, at its best, is called learning. But more often than not, with my tools, it feels like the tail wagging the dog.

Frank Chimero in “No New Tools

For a while I was fighting with the auto-correct features built into various content management systems after I enabled “Correct Spelling Automatically.” It had seemed like a great idea given the number of typos I produce, but it would not let me enter words easily that were not in the built in dictionary and often miscorrected a typo to the wrong word. Better to go back to red squiggly lines under a word that it cannot find in the dictionary. The word “bootstrapper” comes up a lot on this blog, always with red squiggly lines (which can mask when it is misspelled).

Entrepreneurs try to design software tools that make customers lives easier. But it’s hard to avoid assumptions about “the right way” or “why would you ever want to do that” from creeping in. It’s not uncommon to visit a customer who has been using your product for six months or so and have to repress the urge to say “you are using our product wrong!” and instead say, “Wow, that’s an interesting use for our technology: what led you to apply it this way?”

IT organizations developing tools face a double whammy: their own built in assumptions and the end user trying to bake policy into the tool so that it cannot be used to violate policy. I remember watching a demo of a new in-house scheduling tool a few years ago and one of the features was that the schedule was always feasible. You could not overcommit anyone’s time or assign them to competing projects on that theory that people cannot be in two places at once and we should make plans based on extraordinary efforts. Good as far as it went but it rendered the tool useless for planning (which was about two-thirds of the motivation, time tracking was the other primary goal) because you could not enter a preliminary plan and see where it was infeasible. You could enter a plan with slack and underutilized people or equipment, but you could not temporarily overcommit and then shuffle assignments to make it feasible.

We had this same conversation with a recent BeamWise prospect: they wanted the software to prevent any invalid configurations from being designed. Our suggestion was that it was useful to know how much margin/overlap you had between conflicting elements instead of simply knowing that two or more items would not fit together correctly.

I am not advocating for accounting systems that don’t add expenses correctly or tax software that does not produce a correct return. But one of the advantages of software is that it allows you to investigate hypothetical configurations and alternate futures. Think about how you can enable exploration of a design space as much as validate that what is being designed is correct.


Related blog posts

Here are  a few on BeamWiseTM

Recap of “How To Give a Great Demo” at CoFounders Club Wed-Apr-16-2014

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Events, skmurphy

Do The Last Thing First I had a great time at the Cofounder Club last night. Dea Wilson, founder of  Lifograph and organizer for the Meetup, invited me to talk about “Giving a Killer Demo.”  We had  a lively discussion upstairs at Procopio: starting with some introductions and then short demos by the attendees, then I gave a formal recap of the Great Demo methodology and how to apply it.

The key to a Great Demo is to “Do the Last Thing First” and get to the point immediately about the critical results that your software will deliver to the prospect. This is counter to many entrepreneur’s inclination to build up to a big finish after 15  or 30 minutes or longer.

Introduce / Illustrate / Do It / Peel It Back / Q and A / Summarize But by starting with a illustration of the key deliverable and then demonstrating in as few steps as possible how to achieve this result, you ensure that senior decision makers are still in the room when you get to the “Ta Da!” They can ask questions about other capabilities that they are interested in or start a conversation about how they can get started.

The second most important element of a Great Demo is appropriate preparation and a specific and detailed understanding of your prospect’s situation:

  1. Job Title and Industry: this provides a context for understanding how they are measured, likely objectives, and what examples or illustrations may be relevant.
  2. Critical Business Issue: What is the major problem he/she has?
  3. Reasons: Why is it a problem or what is the problem due to?
  4. Specific Capabilities: What capabilities are needed to address the problem?
  5. Delta: What is the value associated with making the change?
  6. Date: Is there a customer critical date or event that needs to be met?

If you are selling software to businesses, consider attending one of the two Great Demo! workshops we have scheduled in 2014 in San Jose

Register Now May 21&22, 2014 “Great Demo!” San Jose, CA

Register Now October 15&16, 2014 “Great Demo!” San Jose, CA

See also

Great Demo Workshop Attendee: “Holy Crap! My Demos Have Too Much Detail”

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Sales, skmurphy, Testimonial, Workshop

After every Great Demo! workshop we contact the attendees with a short E-Mail that reads in part:

I want to check-in to see how you have been doing using the ideas and skills we covered in our Great Demo! Workshop three months ago.  Specifically, I’d like to hear:

  1. What have been the results so far?
  2. Do you have any success stories to report or share?
  3. Any questions or new situations you’d like to discuss?

What follows is a redacted e-mail from a real attendee at a recent Great Demo workshop. We have his permission to post it, but he asked that we remove identifying information because of his candor about his approach to demos before he came to the workshop.

Hello Peter,

I would like to tell you that your workshop has had a positive impact not only on my demos, but also on my customer meetings in general.

The key message I took away, “Do the last thing first,” has proven very effective at increasing customer engagement in our demos. Our product is a sophisticated one with a long history–what are prospects sometimes describe as “very complex” or “arcane” even “confusing.” We sometimes present modules that–in hindsight–were of no of interest to the customer. This can not only turn a demo into a waste of everyone’s time but also convert a hot prospect into a lukewarm one.

It’s seems obvious now, but getting right to the point and then working backwards based on the customer’s level of  interest (“Peeling back the onion”) has triggered a lot more questions and demos that end in clearly defined next steps instead of “you’ve given us a lot to think about, please let us get back to you.”

The example that really punched me in the gut when I realized what I had been doing was your hyperkinetic  impersonation of someone doing a demo of Microsoft Word. Your first answer to  the question, “Can you print?” seemed  reasonable: you opened the print dialog box and walked through all the print options in detail–portrait or landscape, single or double-sided printing; color or black and white, number of copies, print quality, etc…

But when you did the second take and said “Yes, would you like to see it?” and clicked the print icon I had this terrible sinking feeling.

“Holy Crap! My demos have too much detail,” I said to myself.

Change is hard, but the three of us who attended your class took the “Great Demo” approach back and have seen a difference in the number of demos that now lead to sales that are progressing.

You may be in the same predicament if your approach demos involves one or more of the following:

  • You include a multi-slide corporate overview whether the prospect requests it or not.
  • Demos are viewed as an opportunity to provide training on your product.
  • It’s not uncommon for a demo to end with prospects sitting in stunned silence or murmuring, “let us think about this and get back to you” instead of asking questions.

We have two Great Demo! workshops on on the calendar for 2014 in San Jose

May 21&22, 2014 “Great Demo!” San Jose, CA Register Now
October 15&16, 2014 “Great Demo!” San Jose, CA Register Now

Daniel Pink: Entrepreneurs Need Problem Finding Not Just Problem Solving Skills

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, skmurphy

Daniel Pink highlights the need for discovery skills in this interview with Leigh Buchanan in Inc.

Q: What sales traits are crucial for entrepreneurs?

This principle of clarity. Entrepreneurs are moving from a world of problem-solving to a world of problem-finding. The very best ones are able to uncover problems people didn’t realize that they had. Today if the customer knows precisely what their problem is they will probably be able to find a solution on their own. The entrepreneur is more valuable in cases where [customers] don’t know what their problem is or they are wrong about their problem. So surfacing latent problems, anticipating new problems, is really powerful for entrepreneurs.

As you may know we partner with Peter Cohan to offer open enrollment workshops in Silicon Valley  for his “Great Demo” workshop. In the last two years he has added a much more content on discovery and diagnosis as key elements of the sales process. A software demo is just one component of the customer discovery and validation challenges that founders must navigate; a demo can be used early in the process to offer a vision of a solution or later to provide technical proof of a a software product’s capabilities. But without a clear understanding of the prospect’s needs a demo will often miss the mark, hence the need for discovery and diagnosis.

Peter normally works with larger software organizations on-site at a sales all hands meeting but three times a year we partner with him so that startups and smaller software firms can attend a multi-firm workshop in San Jose.  Our next Great Demo! Public Workshop is scheduled for March 5-6 in San Jose, California; register at http://skmcohan140305-cohan.eventbrite.com.

It’s a day and a half well spent: first day focuses the core Great Demo! concepts and the morning of the second day addresses advanced topics and techniques.  We also have one coming up May 21-22: http://skmcohan140521.eventbrite.com/


I have blogged about Daniel Pink twice before:

  • Entrepreneurs, Luck, and Silicon Valley
  • Daniel Pink’s Free Agent Nation Worth Revisiting which highlighted his 7 Laws (my three favorites are bolded)
    Law 1: Independence is the best hedge against a downturn.
    Law 2: When times get tougher, quality counts.
    Law 3: Free to be you and me? We’ve got to be you and me.
    Law 4: You’re on the line. Where else would you want to be?
    Law 5: Up isn’t the only direction.
    Law 6: Bigger isn’t better. Better is better.
    Law 7: Forget survival of the fittest. Think Golden Rule.

BeamWise Demo For BiOS 2014

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Clients in the News, Demos, skmurphy, Video

I have blogged about BeamWise™ in

If you are interested in getting a closer look, Kinetic River will be demonstrating it in booth 8639 at the BiOS Conference February 1-2, 2014. If you don’t want to wait that long contact Giacomo Vacca directly or take a look at a new BeamWise demo video.

Here is the script for the audio track:

BeamWise™ is a software tool for automating biophotonic systems design. It captures an optical layout and generates a detailed optical system design automatically. Outputs include a 3D CAD model for visualization and fully annotated and dimensioned 2D drawings and parts list.

BeamWise also lets designers explore design options as any changes are implemented instantly.

BeamWise is implemented using Design++, a design automation platform that simplifies the capture of engineering expertise

This video will take you through the process of designing an optical system using BeamWise. We will start with a simple sketch on a whiteboard, capture key parameters in BeamWise, review the resulting 3D mechanical model, and generate an annotated and dimensioned drawings and parts lists.

Beams are the key reference points in an optical layout. BeamWise allows you to specify them directly in the mechanical design and use them as reference elements.

Optical system design is a combination of simulation and tinkering in the lab. We start by creating a new design from your optical layout and design parameters. The optical layout is entered as a vector file that lists the system components and their optical connections. From this input, BeamWise generates a detailed optical system design using real optomechanical components.

Next, BeamWise produces a 3D CAD model to visualize the new design. For design verification and release to manufacturing, BeamWise generates annotated dimensioned assembly drawings and a parts list

You have seen us define the beam paths for an optical system and use them as references for the positions of the optical and mechanical elements.

This optical layout is used as an input for BeamWise to create a new optical system design, visualize it in a 3D CAD model, produce fully annotated and dimensioned drawings, and generate a parts list for manufacturing.

We will now demonstrate how BeamWise lets designers explore design options on the fly using the beam as the reference. We will start by shortening a beam segment. This is useful when exploring how to fit the new design into a target enclosure. The design is updated automatically to reflect the new length. Next, we will redirect a beam segment: the change is propagated through the rest of the beam path on the fly.

The design changes are reflected automatically in the 2D drawings and parts list. After BeamWise generates the drawings, the designer can adjust dimensioning and add annotations as needed. The final design can be exported to PDF for easy sharing and review.

Working from a few key parameters, BeamWise can generate a 3D CAD model for the visualization of an optical system design. Dimensioned drawings and parts list are also produced automatically. Changes can be made on the fly using the beams as reference points to explore how best to fit the system into a target enclosure.


If you are interested in getting a closer look, Kinetic River will be in booth 8639 at the BiOS Conference February 1-2, 2014.

We will also be presenting in “Session 1: Sensors and Ruggedized Systems I” on Sunday 2 February 2014 1:30 PM – 3:00 PM

Automated design tools for biophotonic systems (Invited Paper) Paper 8992-1
Author(s): Giacomo Vacca, Kinetic River Corp. (United States); Hannu Lehtimäki, Plan Energy Ltd. (Finland); Tapio Karras, Design Parametrics, Inc. (United States); Sean Murphy, SKMurphy, Inc. (United States)

Abstract: Traditional design methods for flow cytometers and other complex biophotonic systems are increasingly recognized as a major bottleneck in instrumentation development. The many manual steps involved in the analysis and translation of the design, from optical layout to a detailed mechanical model and ultimately to a fully functional instrument, are labor-intensive and prone to wasteful trial-and-error iterations. We have developed two complementary, linked technologies that address this problem: one design tool, LiveIdeasTM provides an intuitive environment for interactive, real-time simulations of system-level performance; the other tool, BeamWiseTM automates the generation of 3D CAD mechanical models based on those simulations. The strength of our approach lies in a parametric modeling strategy that breaks boundaries between engineering subsystems (e.g., optics and fluidics) to predict critical behavior of the instrument as a whole. The results: 70 percent reduction in early-stage project effort, significantly enhancing the probability of success by virtue of a more efficient exploration of the design space.

A First Look at BeamWise In Operation

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Clients in the News, Demos, skmurphy

Dr. Giacomo Vacca of Kinetic River will present a briefing on BeamWise™ at the Twenty-Third Cytometry Development Workshop in Asilomar today. Here is a silent four minute video of some key aspects of BeamWise operation he will narrate live as a part of the briefing. Tapio Karras of Design Parametrics will also be on hand to answer questions. The video was created from a screen capture of BeamWise in operation by Hannu Lehtimäki.

A couple of key points

  • The beams are a key organizing principle for the flow cytometry system.
  • Specifying the beam relationships and distances for each vector between optical elements (e.g. light source (laser), filters, lens, mirrors, prisms, etc..) allow the designer to restrict the changes to those that are relevant to the optical design.

The video starts with a whiteboard sketch of a system that’s then entered into a simple table that specifies key relationships and distances. A 3 dimensional mechanical model is generated based on mechanical dimension data supplied by the manufacturer’s web site for each component., a dimensioned assembly drawing and a bill of materials are also automatically generated.

In a second pass the designer selects a vector between two optical elements and changes it’s length, all of the down stream elements are updated to maintain the distances in the vector specification table. He then changes the direction and related layout for another vector and all the downstream locations are adjusted appropriately. A revised assembly is then generated (the bill of materials is also re-generated but is not affected by the two changes).

Dr. Vacca will also show a scale model mockup of the original assembly that has been 3D printed with the assistance of Paul Spaan of Spaan Enterprises. The video is based on working software and is intended to give designers a sense of the speed of iteration about  configuration options, essentially design space exploration. A prototype instrument might have the base and fixtures 3D printed for speed and accuracy of assembly.

 

Is The Stream Of Your Presentation Stocked With Fish For Your Audience?

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, skmurphy

“Memory is a net: one finds it full of fish when he takes it from the brook, but a dozen miles of water have run through it without sticking.”
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Have you stocked the stream of words in your presentation with at least a few of the fish that your audience is looking for?

What do you hope your audience will remember?

“Always be shorter than anyone dared hope.”
Lord Reading

Peter Cohan: Differentiating Your Offers Starts With The First Contact

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Events, skmurphy, Workshop

Another excerpt from Peter Cohan’s very insightful new article  “Stunningly Awful vs. Truly Terrific Competitive Differentiation – What, When, and How

From the customers’ perspective vendors are “differentiating”, positively or negatively, with every contact, every meeting, and every deliverable.  Let’s explore possible negative differentiation first.  How do you feel about:

  • Vendors that cold call you – repeatedly?
  • Vendors that take forever to answer your email inquiries – or ignore what you asked?
  • Vendors that leap right to showing you a “solution”, without sufficient Discovery?
  • Vendors whose demos look complicated or confusing, in spite of having a pile of “competitive differentiators”?
  • Sales people that speak ill of their competition?
  • Sales people that are “cagey” about providing pricing information?
  • Vendors that over-promise and under-deliver?

Interestingly – and sadly – the list above is what often occurs with typical, traditional vendors and sales people.  Most of us as customers perceive these items as unpleasant and they contribute to an overall negative impression.  Unwittingly, perhaps, these vendors and sales people have differentiated negatively.

Let’s look at the same list again, but with a different approach to each item:

  • Nurture or “trickle” marketing activities (as opposed to cold calling).
  • Rapid, specific responses to email inquiries.
  • Thorough and intelligent Discovery – before presenting solutions.
  • Crisp, focused, engaging demos of the Specific Capabilities needed by customers.
  • Sales teams that are clear and honest about their own offerings’ strengths and limitations.
  • Clear and transparent pricing information.
  • Building a vision of how the customer will move from their current (painful) state to their desired (glorious) future state with the solution in place and operating.

Generally speaking, these activities are viewed favorably by customers.  Vendors that follow these processes are already differentiating positively in comparison with “traditional” vendors.

My take: a startup is negotiating from the first contact with a prospect. They are negotiating for attention, time, insights, data, feedback, revenue, endorsements, etc.. The more you can do from the very first contact to show that you value your prospect’s time, opinions, and ultimately business by how you treat them, the better able you are to differentiate your startup from many common practices that communicate a lack of respect for the customer and their needs.


Peter Cohan’s Great Demo workshop has two seats left on Oct 9-10 in San Jose. This course is most useful for folks developing B2B software products. It’s normally only offered privately on-site at firms like Microsoft, SAS, VMWare, etc… Peter Cohan is also a mentor at StartX and will offer some specific tactics for early stage firms as well.

Register NowGreat Demo: Core Seminar & Advanced Topics
October 9 & 10, 2013
Cost: $930

Where: Moorpark Hotel, 4241 Moorpark Ave, San Jose CA 95129
For out of town attendees: The Moorpark is located 400 feet from the Saratoga Ave exit on Hwy 280, about 7 miles from San Jose Airport and 35 miles from San Francisco Airport Hotels Near Great Demo! Workshop

Peter Cohan: Discovery Conversations Enable Effective Product Differentiation

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Events, skmurphy, Workshop

Peter Cohan has a very insightful new article up on “Stunningly Awful vs. Truly Terrific Competitive Differentiation – What, When, and How” What follows are some excerpts with additional commentary but the entire article is worth reading.

What Is Competitive Differentiation?

Most vendors define this as “capabilities that we have or do better than our competition”.   Pretty straightforward, right?  But do customers share this definition?  Likely not.

Customers are looking for solutions that fit their perception of their current and expected future needs.  A vendor with capabilities the meets these current and future needs exactly is clearly the best choice, everything else being equal (such as price).

So you are faced with assessing current and future needs before you start to demo: you need to diagnose before you can prescribe. The better choice is to withdraw or recommend another alternative if a prospect has one or more requirements that you are clearly unable to satisfy and you know that at least competitor can. Always include the prospects current system (“status quo”) as an alternative: if your offering represents a downgrade on or more critical functions it’s better to withdraw early and in good order than invest a lot of effort only to come up short much later and with loss of time and credibility.

With that in mind, a vendor who seeks to “differentiate” by simply presenting capabilities that another vendor lacks is at risk.  What if the customer doesn’t see the need for these additional capabilities?  What if they don’t care or, worse, can’t use them?  Then these additional capabilities become a liability.

For example, let’s say you are shopping for a new set of kitchen knives.  At the store, you are looking at several knife sets and the sales person steers you to one particular set of 10 knives, saying, “This set is better because it has 10 knives – one more than most – plus a sharpener, so you can keep all of your knives razor-sharp.”  The other sets on display only have nine knives.

Sounds like a win, right?  However, it turns out that your knife block only has room for 9 knives and no place for a sharpener.  You are concerned that the extra knife and sharpener will end up rattling around in a drawer – and possibly be a hazard.  Differentiation has occurred, but not positive differentiation!  The larger knife set is perceived as “too much” and possibly “too expensive” (if it costs more than the set of 9) or “cheap” if the price is the same as the set of 9, since the perception will likely be that each knife individually is worth less.

This is one way for startups to surprise incumbents and larger fuller featured competitors. If the prospect is not using or does not consider certain features important then you can win and leave your competitors muttering “but we had more features…” Peter also highlights the need for a clear assessment of needs before you start to demo: any “extra” features are likely to make your system appear too complicated or too expensive (more features must cost more in most prospects’ minds).

Positive feature- or capability-based differentiation only takes place when the customer agrees that the capability is beneficial in their specific situation – when the customer visualizes using the capability sufficiently often and/or the problem the capability addresses is sufficiently important to solve.  Otherwise, the extra features and capabilities are perceived as making the offering too complicated or too expensive:  “We don’t need the Cadillac; we just want the economy car version…”

Do Discovery with a bias towards potentially differentiating capabilities you offer (and your competition lacks or doesn’t do as well), such that those capabilities become part of the customer’s vision of a solution.

During Discovery, you might say, “Some of the other organizations we’ve worked with that had situations very similar to what you’ve outlined so far, found that the ability to set alerts based on approaching certain thresholds enabled them to take action before problems grew large – and they were able to save hundreds of thousands of dollars as a result.  Is this something you might also find useful in your practice?”

Your customer responds, “Why yes, that sounds really great – and I can see how we could use that.  Wish we’d had it before!”

This capability has now become a Specific Capability desired by your customer – and you can prepare and plan to demonstrate it accordingly.  Since your competition can’t offer the capability, but only the simple alerts, you have successfully positively differentiated.

  1. Similarity:  Your first step is to establish a relationship between your current prospect and other organizations – particularly those that are perceived by the prospect as being similar to them.
  2. Capability:  You describe the capability itself and its advantages and potential benefits.
  3. Reward:  You describe what benefits other, similar organizations have realized through the use of the capability.
  4. Verify: test to see if this capability also sounds interesting or particularly useful to the customer.  If it does, you have successfully and positively differentiated.

This approach is also a good idea during the demo: establish that they are interested in a capability before showing it.


Peter Cohan’s Great Demo workshop has some seats left on Oct 9-10 in San Jose. This course is most useful for folks developing B2B software products. It’s normally only offered privately on-site at firms like Microsoft, SAS, VMWare, etc… Peter Cohan is also a mentor at StartX and will offer some specific tactics for early stage firms as well.

Register NowGreat Demo: Core Seminar & Advanced Topics
October 9 & 10, 2013
Cost: $930

Where: Moorpark Hotel, 4241 Moorpark Ave, San Jose CA 95129
For out of town attendees: The Moorpark is located 400 feet from the Saratoga Ave exit on Hwy 280, about 7 miles from San Jose Airport and 35 miles from San Francisco Airport Hotels Near Great Demo! Workshop

The Lego Box Presentation Method

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, skmurphy

I respect your time so I will keep this short.

In two minutes I can explain why  getting to the point immediately in a presentation or demo to an individual or small group is good for not only the survival but also the growth of your business. It’s the approach least likely to waste your time or theirs, and the most likely to start a serious conversation that can form the basis for a new business relationship.

If you communicate the key points first your audience is much better equipped to process the details: this means that they are more likely to understand you, believe you, and do business with you.

This matches the way the brain works. In “Brain Rules” author John Medina, a developmental molecular biologist, cites cognitive research results that demonstrate that the brain processes meaning before details. He advises:

“Don’t start with the details. Start with the key ideas, and in a hierarchical fashion, form the details around these larger notions.”

What are two key points to communicate?

  • First, that you will repay a few minutes of their attention with information that is relevant to their situation and actionable.
  • Second, how your offering will help them address a critical business issue–and result in more revenue, more profit, or reduced risk.

If you present the meaning first, you will naturally adopt the other person’s point of view and you will be much less likely to overwhelm them because you are presenting your ideas in a way that is most easily processed.

Why is this hard to do? Because we like to save the best for last.

Whether it’s the punch line to a joke or the identity of the killer in a whodunit, we like to withhold the key piece of information that organizes and make sense of everything else that has been said.

But this is a match to the wrong presentation format for the story you want to tell.

Instead think about the Lego box photo, the first thing that you see on a store shelf or on Amazon.com. Lego has a well-known brand name, founded in 1932 and still privately held, it has produced more than 400 billion toy bricks.

Star Fighter MVPThe company puts the most important information first on the box. A photo of the Lego Star Wars x-Wing Starfighter provides a clear context to the prospective parent buyer or a child who is building a birthday wish list.

The first thing you see after you open the Starfighter box is 560 multi-colored pieces and a collegiate dictionary-size book of assembly directions.  It’s obvious why the company does not put these images on the box.

Two final examples.

  • A cooking show will start with a shot of the final dish, for example barbecue spare ribs for your next cookout. Because we eat with our eyes first, this may entice  you to continue watching to learn how to prepare the ribs.
  • A newspaper prints headlines in large type, and the gist of the story in the first sentence, so that you can decide whether or not to read the whole article.

Why should your presentation be any different?


Michelle.McIntyreMichelle McIntyre (@FromMichelle) contributed to this blog post. She is the president of Michelle McIntyre Communications, a public relations consulting firm serving small businesses and software start-ups in the U.S. and Europe. McIntyre has won 10 awards in the past two decades in her career at IBM and three public relations firms including Global Fluency, parent company of the Chief Marketing Officer Council.

Set Your PowerPoints on Stun

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Events, skmurphy

Q: I didn’t get any questions at the end of a recent demo. The audience was quiet and respectful and our point of contact said “It’s an interesting product, you’ve given us a lot to think about.” But it’s been two weeks and I haven’t had any response to my two follow up e-mails and a voicemail.

A: It’s very likely that they felt your product was not a fit with their needs and being polite was the fastest way to get you out of the room. Avoid the temptation to demo to early by first getting agreement on what the key business is that they are looking for help on and then clarifying what are two or three capabilities they believe they need to address their needs. A crisp presentation that demonstrates those capabilities–and only those capabilities–should lead to a longer conversation.

Q: I didn’t get any questions during a recent demo, and two of the key audience members spent a lot of time e-mailing on a tablet or texting on a phone. What can I do when a prospects starts to multi-task?

A: If you have a whiteboard or flip chart ask them to sketch an answer to a question. If you open with a very brief intro that confirms their critical business issue and the capabilities they are looking for it’s less likely they will tune you out.

If you are not sure what business challenge they are looking for help with open with some questions of them about what they are using now, what their current workflow looks like, and where they are looking for help. Diagnose before you prescribe and you should be able to get their attention. If that does not work then you may be a “check in the box” that they have talked to enough vendors (also know as “column fodder” where they can compare your offering to several others including their first choice).

Another alternative for a large group is to offer a menu of features or capabilities and ask for a show of hands to prioritize what you should show first.

If it’s a senior person or decision maker who is tuning you out, you need to engage them. If it’s only one person in a group of five or six and everyone else is engaged I would not be as concerned. They may either be bored (in which case engaging them will help) or worried about another situation (sick child, major service outage, urgent text from their boss) in which case they may need to leave.


We partner with Peter Cohan to bring an open enrollment version of his “Great Demo!” workshop to Silicon Valley several times a year. The next “Great Demo!” workshop is October 9-10, 2013.

Core Seminar & Advanced Topics
October 9 & 10, 2013
Cost: $930 (Before Sep-8: $895)
Eventbrite - Great Demo! Workshop on Oct 9 & 10, 2013

Where: Moorpark Hotel, 4241 Moorpark Ave, San Jose CA 95129

For out of town attendees: The Moorpark is located 400 feet from the Saratoga Ave exit on Hwy 280, about 7 miles from San Jose Airport and 35 miles from San Francisco Airport Hotels Near Great Demo! Workshop

For New Products Prospect Objections Are Valuable Data

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in 3 Early Customer Stage, Audio, Demos, skmurphy

For some clients we record our working sessions so that they can play them back later and we can listen to them and improve the quality of our interaction and improvisation.

What follows is a 90 second snippet from a recent working session that contains a true story about a conversation I had several years ago with a former co-worker who asked me to do him a favor and look at the demo of a new startup he had gone to work for.

Or download SmarterProspects (MP3) 90 seconds.

We have always talked about “early customers, early revenue.”

The new product introduction problem, the new product sales problem is a distinct problem from the scale up problem.

Getting those first six to twelve B2B sales is a very different problem from scaling.

Whether you want to it call it an exploratory approach or discovery driven sales, it’s a very different sales process than most sales guys are used to.

Very early on I got called in by a guy that I had worked with who had been VP of sales at a billion dollar software company who had gone to a startup. He had gone through 30 sales calls.

We sat down and he took me through the demo. He had two other engineers working with him and they some interesting technology. It was a little bit of a kitchen sink product but it was in an area where VP of sales had connections and they had had 30 visits to prospects.

And the demo went on for about 90 minutes. Afterward I said, “Can you show me the first version of this demo that you gave to the first prospect?”

They asked “What do you mean?”

I said, “Can you tell me how the demo has changed since you started showing it.”

He looked at me and said “That’s the problem! We need to find smarter prospects!

True story. I realized that when he had worked in sales at large companies they didn’t a sales pitch that doesn’t work. So most sales guys assume that what they need to do is handle objections not change the basic pitch.

For the most part for early stage entrepreneurs the objections are actually data: they offer insights for how to improve the pitch.

Take aways for first time entrepreneurs thinking about hiring a sales person:

  1. If you are selling a product that is form, fit, and function compatible with existing offerings you can hire someone who has sold to your customers a similar product and probably do well if you check references and go on sales calls with them for a few weeks.
  2. If it’s a novel product or a new market you need to learn how to sell it before you can hire somebody to sell it for you. You need to develop the sales materials and appropriate checklists for qualifying an opportunity, planning a sale, and closing the opportunity. Once you have closed a few sales you and you have a basic process you can then hire a sales person and teach them how to sell your product. Not how to sell, but how to sell your product.
  3. Six to eight minutes is a good running length for a basic demo. If that triggers more questions or comments then you can take as long as the prospect is interested. But you need to get your key points across in the first few minutes.

Related blog posts

Learning the Right Lessons From Failure

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in 3 Early Customer Stage, Customer Development, Demos, Founder Story, skmurphy

John Finneran recently wrote a postmortem on a startup that aspired to be “the 37 Signals of non-profit software entitled “Fat startup: Learn the lessons of my failed Lean Startup.

It’s a candid narrative the ends with four “lessons learned”

First, pursue achingly high standards in every aspect of your startup. Mediocre execution will slowly murder your startup.

Second, narrow the scope of your product until you can develop an extraordinary product. The purpose of your first release (and every other release)  is to give your customer immediate value. You are not launching a series of science experiments for you to learn what you should already know.

Third, find enough funds for a substantial marketing budget.

Finally, beware of Lean Startup principles, or any other shrink-wrapped utopia offered by the entrepreneurial dream industry.  A weekend trip in a “Lean Startup Machine” may feel useful and fun, but treat their practical value with extreme skepticism.

I had a different set of lessons from this article than the conclusions that the author draws:

  • Your customer is the firm that will pay you. They picked a problem–writing a grant application that relies on a “logic model”–that may not be a real need. They interviewed 1,000 people seeking grants and found “writing a logic model is confusing, complicated, and impractical.” They don’t appear to have interviewed the organizations requiring the logic model to determine how it would be used beyond the grant application. If it’s only needed for a presentation then a PowerPoint version may be all that’s ever needed. I think there may be a deeper need to uncover in understanding why a logic model is required and how it’s updated over it’s lifetime. Conclusion: if you are going to create an on-line artifact to replace a powerpoint slide make sure it will be used more than once (e.g. needs to be updated quarterly to maintain grant, etc..). An alternative customer might have been to find grant writing consultants who wanted to become more productive.
  • Pick a problem or pain point that is real and preferably recurring. One way to tell that it’s real is that a prospect will find value even in a partial solution or offering that only addresses a portion of the full problem. This is the core of a minimum viable product: it provides enough value for a target customer’s real problem/need that they will make a minimum purchase. Instead “our original idea put on weight quickly” they expanded their initial concept to become the 37signals of non-profit software.
  • Most assumptions you make when you start out will prove to be imperfect and in need of refinement: plan for this. This is not a fault of any particular business model approach, it’s a function of your knowledge of the customer’s needs and buying process. One example from this situation: “We assumed customers would sign up online with a credit card.’ Most B2B software, at least for initial sales, will have to be sold with many conversations much hand holding. Lacking any testimonials or case studies, you will have to have a number of serious conversations with a prospect to ensure that you understand their needs and that they agree that you do.
  • Rehearse the demo an internal champion (“earlyvangelist”) is going to run using their exact configuration; do this with enough lead time that you can identify and fix any issues it uncovers. If your internal champion does not want to rehearse then they are not really an earlyvangelist.
  • Always consider starting out by selling the result that a customer wants as a service.  This is a startup that would have benefited from using the concierge model or partnering with a consulting firm already doing logic models. Their target customer wanted to pay for a logic model, they should have started by selling that result. It’s not clear if the customer would have used the application after submitting the grant so selling the result would have been a better place to start.

Hypothesis Not Hype For A New Product

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in 3 Early Customer Stage, Demos, skmurphy

Resist the temptation to hype your new product, treat it as an hypothesis not just in your own mind but also in how you describe it to prospects.

If strangers tell you what they like about your product or particular ways that  they found it useful then you can use that in your messaging for the product since this is independent substantiation of value.

The real challenge is to continue to refine your offering by ongoing engagement with prospects and customers. This enables you to evolve a viable product into a delightful one.  But if you don’t ship until you believe it’s delightful then two things can happen:

  1. You may raise the bar too high in your own mind and never ship: you will miss out on the criticisms and suggestions that will help you refine and enhance your product.
  2. If you believe that your product is awesome then you may ignore useful criticism and real possibilities for continued improvement.

Entrepreneurs should not be content with a “minimum viable” product but that should not stop you from shipping it. An MVP won’t  prevent  you from creating an awesome product, on the contrary, it will actually start the real conversations with customers that will allow you to discover the gestalt of key features that a great product embodies.

Ilya Semin of Datanyze on Value of Great Demo Workshop

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, skmurphy

Register Great DemoThere are still a few seats available for the March 6-7 Great Demo workshop in San Jose.

We reach out to past attendees of the Great Demo workshop and ask them how they have applied the principles and techniques covered and what the impact has been on their business. Ilya Semin, the founder of software startup Datanyze, attended a workshop in 2012 and sent us this detailed response. It is reproduced here with his permission.

My name is Ilya Semin. I’m the founder of Datanyze (www.datanyze.com). Our product provides competitive intelligence for certain types of companies (Web analytics, Widgets, CDN, DNS, etc). It helps answer questions like “Who are the biggest customers of my competitor?” or “Who of my customers is currently evaluating one of my competitors?” The tool is very powerful and the best way to prove that is to demonstrate it to our potential customers.

My background is Computer Science and I’m used to dealing with computers, not humans. Perhaps that’s why sales is not something that I’m comfortable with, but as a founder of a small start-up I have to be involved in sales almost every day.

When it comes to demonstrating a product most people present it in a very fuzzy, unclear way. I’ve seen that so many times but I did not have the answer on how to make this process better. What I’ve learned during the Workshop completely changed the way I demonstrate our product.

Peter gave a very clear explanation and lots of examples on why traditional demos don’t work. What I really liked about the workshop is that not only it gives you a theoretical knowledge about why some demos are more efficient that the others, but it also provides a clear process for organizing demos and forces you to work on your own demo and make it better during the day. We were working in pairs to improve our pitches and everyone had a chance to present their products.  I really learned a lot from this workshop, I feel like it will be useful for everyone who is in sales, no matter what their level. We had some very experienced folks in the group and people like me who just started to practice it and I feel like everyone was very excited at the end of the day.

Update-Jan-20-2014: DataNyze profiled in VentureBeat: “This Startup Tells You When Companies Try Your Competitor’s Software.

Chris Kane: Great Demo’s Impact On The VendorRisk Sales Presentation

Written by Sean Murphy. Posted in Demos, Events, skmurphy

Register Great DemoThere are still a few seats available for the March 6-7 Great Demo workshop in San Jose.

We reach out to past attendees of the Great Demo workshop and ask them how they have applied the principles and techniques covered and what the impact has been on their business. Chris Kane of VendorRisk attended a workshop in 2012 and sent us this detailed response. It is reproduced here with his permission.

Software demos are the cornerstone of our sales process. We had successfully demonstrated our service to many prospects and closed a number of deals before we attended the Great Demo workshop, but we still felt that there was room for improvement.

One of the big changes we have made in putting the Great Demo methods into practice has been to cut the running time of our demo from an hour and 15 minutes or even two hours down to about 30 or 35 minutes. VendorRisk is a SaaS app, so our demos involve setting up the story, showing a few screenshots, and switching to the live app depending upon the prospect’s areas of interest.

Looking back we tended to bounce from topic to topic and feature to feature using a training model as our structure. Now we use a progression of simple to complex stories and use cases. As a result, our prospects more easily connect with how they can use the software for the commonly occurring–and then the less commonly occurring–situations that come up in managing vendor contracts.

We have also introduced a 15-minute phone conversation in advance of the main demo to help better understand a prospect’s critical business issues before we start the first demonstration. This has been very well received: our newer customers have told us that they feel like we’ve really listened to their needs and are showing them a demo tailored specifically for them–despite the fact that almost all our customers have the exact same issues! It’s increased our confidence going into the demo because we have fewer surprise issues or areas of concern.

We have seen the benefits of this preparation and change in delivery style in an increase in the percentage of prospects who become customers.

Chris Kane, Partner, VendorRisk

Great Demo! Workshop on March 6 & 7, 2013

Written by Theresa Shafer. Posted in Demos, Events, Sales

Create and Deliver Surprisingly Compelling Software Demonstrations
“Do The Last Thing First” — the recipe for a Great Demo!

This is an interactive workshop with Peter Cohan geared especially for you who demonstrate B-to-B software to your customer and channels. Bring a copy of your demo and be prepared to present it — we’ll help you turn it into a surprisingly compelling demo. More information

Core Seminar & Advanced Topics
March 6 & 7, 2013
Cost: $930 (Before Feb 4: $895)
Register Great Demo

Where: Moorpark Hotel, 4241 Moorpark Ave, San Jose CA 95129
For out of town attendees: The Moorpark is located 400 feet from the Saratoga Ave exit on Hwy 280, about 7 miles from San Jose Airport and 35 miles from San Francisco Airport Hotels Near Great Demo! Workshop

“I am confident that with the insights gained from your workshop we will land more customers in fewer iterations.”
Lav Pachuri, CEO, Xleron Inc.

“Peter Cohan’s Great Demo method really works. It helped us win DEMOgod, and it has allowed us to explain our offering much more clearly to prospects.”
Chaim Indig, CEO, Phreesia
(See “DEMOgod Winner Phreesia Praises Peter Cohan Training“)

More information on the workshop

ABOUT THE SPEAKER: Peter Cohan, Principal at The Second Derivative
Community Web Site:  http://greatdemo.blogspot.com/

Peter Cohan is the founder and principal of The Second Derivative, focused on helping software organizations improve their sales and marketing results – primarily through improving organizations’ demonstrations.

The bulk of his experience is with complex, enterprise software and strategic systems sold to varied audiences in a range of vertical markets.  He has enjoyed roles in technical and product marketing, marketing management, sales and sales management, and senior management.

In 2003, he authored Great Demo!, a book that provides methods to create and execute compelling demonstrations.  The 2nd edition of Great Demo! was published March, 2005.

In July 2004, he enabled and began moderating DemoGurus®, a community web exchange dedicated to helping sales and marketing teams improve their software demonstrations, which was subsequently transitioned to the Great Demo! LinkedIn Group in 2010-2011.

Before The Second Derivative, Peter founded the Discovery Tools® business unit at Symyx Technologies, Inc., where he grew the business from an empty spreadsheet into a $30 million per year operation.  Prior to Symyx, Peter served in marketing, sales, and management positions at MDL Information Systems, a leading provider of scientific information management software.  Peter currently serves on the Board of Directors for Collaborative Drug Discovery, Inc., is an advisor to NewallStreet, Inc. and a mentor to StartX, the Stanford University start-up accelerator.  He holds a degree in chemistry.

Peter has experience as an individual contributor, manager and senior management in marketing, sales, and business development.  He has also been, and continues to be, a customer.

Day 1 Agenda:

  • 8:15 AM Breakfast & Registration
  • 8:30 AM Workshop begins
  • Noon Lunch
  • 1 PM Workshop Continues
  • 5 PM Wrap up

Day 2 Agenda:

  • 8:15 AM Breakfast & Registration
  • 8:30 AM Workshop begins on Advanced Topics
  • 12:30pm Wrap up

Seating is Limited

For more information: Theresa 408-252-9676 events@skmurphy.com

Great Demo! Workshop on May 22-23, 2013

Written by Theresa Shafer. Posted in Demos, Events, Sales

Create and Deliver Surprisingly Compelling Software Demonstrations
“Do The Last Thing First” — the recipe for a Great Demo!

This is an interactive workshop with Peter Cohan geared especially for you who demonstrate B-to-B software to your customer and channels. Bring a copy of your demo and be prepared to present it — we’ll help you turn it into a surprisingly compelling demo. More information

Core Seminar & Advanced Topics
May 22 & 23, 2013
Cost: $930 (Before April-20: $895)
Register Great Demo

Where: Moorpark Hotel, 4241 Moorpark Ave, San Jose CA 95129
For out of town attendees: The Moorpark is located 400 feet from the Saratoga Ave exit on Hwy 280, about 7 miles from San Jose Airport and 35 miles from San Francisco Airport Hotels Near Great Demo! Workshop

“I am confident that with the insights gained from your workshop we will land more customers in fewer iterations.”
Lav Pachuri, CEO, Xleron Inc.

“Peter Cohan’s Great Demo method really works. It helped us win DEMOgod, and it has allowed us to explain our offering much more clearly to prospects.”
Chaim Indig, CEO, Phreesia
(See “DEMOgod Winner Phreesia Praises Peter Cohan Training“)

More information on the workshop

ABOUT THE SPEAKER: Peter Cohan, Principal at The Second Derivative
Community Web Site:  http://greatdemo.blogspot.com/

Peter Cohan is the founder and principal of The Second Derivative, focused on helping software organizations improve their sales and marketing results – primarily through improving organizations’ demonstrations.

The bulk of his experience is with complex, enterprise software and strategic systems sold to varied audiences in a range of vertical markets.  He has enjoyed roles in technical and product marketing, marketing management, sales and sales management, and senior management.

In 2003, he authored Great Demo!, a book that provides methods to create and execute compelling demonstrations.  The 2nd edition of Great Demo! was published March, 2005.

In July 2004, he enabled and began moderating DemoGurus®, a community web exchange dedicated to helping sales and marketing teams improve their software demonstrations, which was subsequently transitioned to the Great Demo! LinkedIn Group in 2010-2011.

Before The Second Derivative, Peter founded the Discovery Tools® business unit at Symyx Technologies, Inc., where he grew the business from an empty spreadsheet into a $30 million per year operation.  Prior to Symyx, Peter served in marketing, sales, and management positions at MDL Information Systems, a leading provider of scientific information management software.  Peter currently serves on the Board of Directors for Collaborative Drug Discovery, Inc., is an advisor to NewallStreet, Inc. and a mentor to StartX, the Stanford University start-up accelerator.  He holds a degree in chemistry.

Peter has experience as an individual contributor, manager and senior management in marketing, sales, and business development.  He has also been, and continues to be, a customer.

Day 1 Agenda:

  • 8:15 AM Breakfast & Registration
  • 8:30 AM Workshop begins
  • Noon Lunch
  • 1 PM Workshop Continues
  • 5 PM Wrap up

Day 2 Agenda:

  • 8:15 AM Breakfast & Registration
  • 8:30 AM Workshop begins on Advanced Topics
  • 12:30pm Wrap up

Seating is Limited

For more information: Theresa 408-252-9676 events@skmurphy.com

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